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52,341 hits 3.3 (4 votes) Share Favorite | Flag 5 years ago by snarf

Are more Blacks being killed by cops or are we just paying attention for a change?


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5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 4:56:15 AM EST (GMT-5)
Gut feeling-

There's a lot less Blacks being shot by cops now than in the 60's and the numbers have been declining for a long time.

I guess since no more airplanes went missing the media decided to focus on this for a while.
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 5:12:59 AM EST (GMT-5)
I think it's 'more attention'.

Which is a good thing, as hopefully it make cops think twice before going to the default behaviour of 'shoot the n*gger'.
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 5:26:07 AM EST (GMT-5)
Are we even paying more attention? I can't really tell.
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 5:26:45 AM EST (GMT-5)
Is that a rabbit over there?
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 6:51:27 AM EST (GMT-5)
More attention, ever since Stand Your Ground and Treyvon...
it needs more momentum because despite some variance in the context of individual cases, we do need checks for police brutality.
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 6:53:03 AM EST (GMT-5)
*Trayvon (Also, I know Stand Your Ground didn't have to do with cops, but it did have much to do with racial profiling and our justice system.)
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 8:30:00 AM EST (GMT-5)
More than what?

More than whites? Percentage wise yes.

More than this time last year or ten years ago? I don't know.

Either way, it doesn't seem like a bad idea to address pervasive racism, militarization of, and excessive use of force by police. Or the seeming impunity they have in these circumstances.
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 8:35:31 AM EST (GMT-5)
I meant are there more Blacks killed this year than last and the years before.

Everyone knows more Blacks are killedthan Whites bcause Whites can do no wrong and each time they are shot it's a tragic accident.
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 8:47:50 AM EST (GMT-5)
Does anyone really think that it's happening *more*?

Even if the number is declining, it can still be disproportionate in terms of a) the number of shootings by police overall, or b) the number of black individuals involved in crime.

Like GS and orangefanta said, I think it'd be misguided to attribute it all to media hype at the expense of considering potential problems in the system. The long term trends don't tell you whether the situation was handled as it should've been in these particular cases.
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 9:57:27 AM EST (GMT-5)
On Monday 12/8/14 - 8:47:50 AM Floor Demon wrote:
Like...orangefanta said, I think it'd be misguided to attribute it all to media hype at the expense of considering potential problems in the system.

Agreed. Blaming the media seems to coincide w/ a pov that doesn't want to deal w/ it, like it's a fake issue the media created as opposed to a real issue the media is covering. And even if it's a real issue the media has chosen to cover a lot, and w/ an agenda, that shouldn't mean the real issue is ignored.
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 10:17:36 AM EST (GMT-5)
#16

You're a child, IRL.

And I love the irony. You whinge about your post being shortened and then do exactly that, in order to remove reference to me.

Are you really so small and petty?

Don't bother answering, the answer is objectively yes.
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 10:25:44 AM EST (GMT-5)
Blaming 'it all' on the media perhaps does, but I think the media does deserve some of the blame for the way they seem to attempt to influence public opinion. Trial by the media has become very commonplace these days.

When the media presents a slant in their reporting rather than giving fair and balanced treatment to both sides, they deserve to be blamed for fanning the flames.

I think that type of reporting also does a disservice to the cases where the cops are actually abusing their power and/or authority by making it easier to dismiss the incident as a case of 'media hype'.
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 10:25:45 AM EST (GMT-5)
On Monday 12/8/14 - 8:35:31 AM snarf wrote:
I meant are there more Blacks killed this year than last and the years before. Everyone knows more Blacks are killedthan Whites bcause Whites can do no wrong and each time they are shot it's a tragic accident.

in the raw numbers, there are more whites killed by police than blacks


but looking at the percentages, black people are shot at a higher percentage than white people


also, i never hear about white people being shot and killed by police that didn't deserve to be shot
not that they all deserved to be killed, but i have to imagine the circumstances are at least more clearly in police favor
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 10:33:05 AM EST (GMT-5)
On Monday 12/8/14 - 10:25:45 AM Disappears wrote:
also, i never hear about white people being shot and killed by police that didn't deserve to be shot not that they all deserved to be killed, but i have to imagine the circumstances are at least more clearly in police favor


That could be an example of how media coverage influences public opinion.

5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 10:39:20 AM EST (GMT-5)
On Monday 12/8/14 - 10:25:45 AM Disappears wrote:
in the raw numbers, there are more whites killed by police than blacks


where are you getting these numbers?
This article contains some interesting statistics on the topic.
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 10:43:23 AM EST (GMT-5)
yeah, that adds up to what i said

there are like 200,000,000 more white people than black people
so i think the numbers i saw for last year were like 123 black people killed to 300 and something white people killed

but, again, when looked at in terms of percentages, black people are killed at a higher rate
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 10:51:39 AM EST (GMT-5)
It definitely agrees with what you said, but I want to see raw numbers and the article I posted only shows rates and percentages. Was curious to know if you had anything else to read.

Also, I just read the first comment in this thread... numbers may have gone down, just like the crime rate has gone down for so much of the country, but it's not arbitrary media coverage, and there's still so much more to be done. If the media could "decide to focus" on the school-to-prison pipeline next, or on the disproportionate numbers of Black Americans sentenced to life imprisonment, that would be cool.
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 11:04:43 AM EST (GMT-5)
I got the raw numbers from bill oreilley

but he was completely ignoring the percentage aspect and only focused on the fact that 300>125
which is far too simplistic a way of looking at things
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 11:50:28 AM EST (GMT-5)
Its 326, not 300, but there are reasons to believe the data (both 123 and 326) is flawed. Which means it could be out of whack either direction. But let's just run with those numbers since its all we have. The population is only about 15% Black. So its obvious that a disproportionate number of blacks are being killed by police.

Blacks are imprisoned at roughly 6 times the rate of whites. It would seem to follow that Blacks also are having encounters with the police disproportionate to their make up of the society.

So lets take a second and look at this: 6 times as many Blacks are incarcerated but ONLY roughly 2 times as many are shot and killed. It seems to me that whites are disproportionately being shot by police, not blacks.
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 12:11:12 PM EST (GMT-5)
HAHAHA
next
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 1:05:17 PM EST (GMT-5)
There is a murky base-rate issue, though.

As has been said, you can't just compare the number of black people shot by police with the number of white people shot by police - it's a base rate fallacy (i.e. you're ignoring that there are more white people in the population).

Similarly, the article you posted says:

"Our analysis included dividing the number of people of each race killed by police by the number of people of that race living in the country at the time, to produce two different rates: the risk of getting killed by police if you are white and if you are black."

That sort of assumes that you have the same crime rates in both populations (i.e. that they're equally likely to have encounters with police etc.). The data from incarceration rates suggest that isn't true. Granted, those incarceration rates are not independent of the issues we're discussing.
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 1:07:10 PM EST (GMT-5)
So where to from there; the probability of being shot by police *if* you're black/white and *if* you've committed a crime? Identifying the extent and nature of the problem probably requires more than very simple statistics, that's why it's such an issue that there's so little decent data in the area.
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 1:09:28 PM EST (GMT-5)
On Monday 12/8/14 - 10:17:36 AM Guilty_Spark wrote:
#16 You're a child, IRL. And I love the irony. You whinge about your post being shortened and then do exactly that, in order to remove reference to me. Are you really so small and petty? Don't bother answering, the answer is objectively yes.

You think it was an accident?
I thought you said abbreviating for space was completely fine, even if you completely change the meaning of what was said and then respond to the new meaning.
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 1:12:09 PM EST (GMT-5)
On Monday 12/8/14 - 10:25:44 AM CowDung wrote:
Blaming 'it all' on the media perhaps does, but I think the media does deserve some of the blame for the way they seem to attempt to influence public opinion.

I don't really think that's the case w/ most media. I think Fox News does. I will admit MSNBC does. I don't think the networks or CNN really do as often. I think Fox News has created the narrative that everyone does it to justify their doing it.

But even so, that's *part* of the conversation, and whenever I see it brought up, it seems like someone is trying to make that the *entirety* of the conversation.
5 yrs ago, 9 mos ago - Monday 12/8/14 - 1:14:58 PM EST (GMT-5)
On Monday 12/8/14 - 10:25:44 AM CowDung wrote:
Blaming 'it all' on the media perhaps does, but I think the media does deserve some of the blame for the way they seem to attempt to influence public opinion.
On Monday 12/8/14 - 1:12:09 PM IRLIteach wrote:
I don't really think that's the case w/ most media. I think Fox News does. I will admit MSNBC does. I don't think the networks or CNN really do as often. I think Fox News has created the narrative that everyone does it to justify their doing it. But even so, that's *part* of the conversation, and whenever I see it brought up, it seems like someone is trying to make that the *entirety* of the conversation.


See how many news hits you get when you Google 'Dillon Taylor' and compare it with the news hits you get when you Google 'Michael Brown'.


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