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2,084 hits 3.3 (4 votes) Share Favorite | Flag 8 years ago by Abzurd

If you had to choose your strongest allegiance, would it be your religion or your country?
This question applies mostly to patriotic and religious people, of course.


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8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 3:40:18 PM EST (GMT-5)
SInce I'm agnostic, I have no strong religious ties. I chose country by default then. I'm not patriotic in the slightest though. I like Canada, but would have no qualms about up and leaving for somewhere else if the opportunity came around.
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 3:42:37 PM EST (GMT-5)
I answer to my own moral authority which I believe to be derived from what I suppose you could call God

I don't have any actual allegiance to my country.
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 4:00:15 PM EST (GMT-5)
Religon. When you live in a country thats only going to last another 20 years tops you pick religon
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 4:14:50 PM EST (GMT-5)
On Saturday 9/11/10 - 4:00:15 PM seta wrote:
Religon. When you live in a country thats only going to last another 20 years tops you pick religon


20 years?

What on Earth would make you say that?
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 4:15:42 PM EST (GMT-5)
SOCIALISM, MAN

seriously though I think the post-war imperial policies are going to lead to a downfall of sorts, but within 20 years? that's being a bit premature
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 4:16:40 PM EST (GMT-5)
I don't know.

I like the country I live in.

I don't like religion.

So..country?
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 4:19:28 PM EST (GMT-5)
TBH, short of some huge global calamity that will utterly change the global political landscape, the US is going to be around a long time.

From the inside it may look divided and filled with discord, but that's the way it's always been. The US is one of the most stable countries on Earth with a political system well designed for adapting to change and shocks. It's not like the Congo where coups are a national sport.
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 4:28:16 PM EST (GMT-5)
yeah, if you remove a bloody civil war, president assassinations attempts, it's pretty stable. Adapting to change? I think not.
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 4:52:18 PM EST (GMT-5)
americans think about it. america is failing epically.
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 5:25:49 PM EST (GMT-5)
On Saturday 9/11/10 - 4:28:16 PM Abzurd wrote:
yeah, if you remove a bloody civil war, president assassinations attempts, it's pretty stable. Adapting to change? I think not.


Still doesn't change the fact that in the over 200 years the US has remained completely intact.

Comparatively, France has had five different Republics within the lifespan of the US, and that's not even counting all the dictators and kings that have filled the gaps.

And yes, it is adaptive to change. It's the whole purpose of a democratic system.
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 5:26:54 PM EST (GMT-5)
On Saturday 9/11/10 - 4:52:18 PM seta wrote:
americans think about it. america is failing epically.


In other words, you have nothing of actual substance or meaning to say
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 5:28:12 PM EST (GMT-5)
myself
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 5:57:04 PM EST (GMT-5)
Presidents are getting stupider. China is getting richer and Korea is getting crazier
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 6:01:13 PM EST (GMT-5)
Considering I don't have a religion, I'd say country.
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 6:16:18 PM EST (GMT-5)
"Presidents are getting stupider. China is getting richer and Korea is getting crazier"

Have you ever even opened a history book?

Johnson was barely literate. Buchanan caused the country to momentarily split apart due to his incompetence. Before Van Buren, the 8th president to actually have a bathtub installed in the white house. Every president before had not even considered bathing to be necessary.

So what if China is getting richer? In the early 20th century the US eclipsed Britain as the richest country in the world. That was 100 years ago and Britain is still around.

And North Korea is no threat to the US. None whatsoever. It's a starving nation, and if it wasn't for humanitarian aid, all it's people would be dead by now. NK does pose a threat to Japan, but the US is a continent away and NK could not possibly win any war it starts.
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 6:19:48 PM EST (GMT-5)
that last point depends on how much support they get from China

WW3 is still a possibility and so is losing it
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 6:26:01 PM EST (GMT-5)
China would never support NK if it actually declared war. The 50's are long past and now China is much more capitalist and has a lot more to lose.

China relies too much on the US and the other Western powers. They made a deal with the Devil, or a deal with capitalism more appropriately. They got the money, booming economy and surge in industries that came with buying into capitalism, but they did so at the cost of connecting themselves to the fates of all the other capitalist countries. Since the US is their biggest trading partner, war would mean an incredible blow to their economy and a loss of everything they've built up in the last few decades.

You can tell how precarious their situation is by just how hard they try to present a good image of themselves to the world. You wouldn't see half this fear of internal disapproval under Mao. China is no longer self-contained.
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 7:45:18 PM EST (GMT-5)
On Saturday 9/11/10 - 4:28:16 PM Abzurd wrote:
yeah, if you remove a bloody civil war, president assassinations attempts, it's pretty stable. Adapting to change? I think not.
On Saturday 9/11/10 - 5:25:49 PM griffin_wf wrote:
Still doesn't change the fact that in the over 200 years the US has remained completely intact. Comparatively, France has had five different Republics within the lifespan of the US, and that's not even counting all the dictators and kings that have filled the gaps. And yes, it is adaptive to change. It's the whole purpose of a democratic system.


Your civil war is very much in the way of your 200 years of stability.

And the US is pretty much refractory to change. As we can clearly see now.

8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 8:04:40 PM EST (GMT-5)
the Chinese supported NK during the Korean war
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 8:05:36 PM EST (GMT-5)
On Saturday 9/11/10 - 6:19:48 PM Kungfullama wrote:
that last point depends on how much support they get from China WW3 is still a possibility and so is losing it

most likely we'll lose it
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 8:35:06 PM EST (GMT-5)
On Saturday 9/11/10 - 8:04:40 PM seta wrote:
the Chinese supported NK during the Korean war


"The 50's are long past and now China is much more capitalist and has a lot more to lose."
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 8:37:04 PM EST (GMT-5)
On Saturday 9/11/10 - 4:28:16 PM Abzurd wrote:
yeah, if you remove a bloody civil war, president assassinations attempts, it's pretty stable. Adapting to change? I think not.
On Saturday 9/11/10 - 5:25:49 PM griffin_wf wrote:
Still doesn't change the fact that in the over 200 years the US has remained completely intact. Comparatively, France has had five different Republics within the lifespan of the US, and that's not even counting all the dictators and kings that have filled the gaps. And yes, it is adaptive to change. It's the whole purpose of a democratic system.
On Saturday 9/11/10 - 7:45:18 PM Abzurd wrote:
Your civil war is very much in the way of your 200 years of stability. And the US is pretty much refractory to change. As we can clearly see now.


Got any actual reasons?
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 8:39:52 PM EST (GMT-5)
On Saturday 9/11/10 - 8:04:40 PM seta wrote:
the Chinese supported NK during the Korean war
On Saturday 9/11/10 - 8:35:06 PM griffin_wf wrote:
"The 50's are long past and now China is much more capitalist and has a lot more to lose."

America is getting poorer and China is getting Richer. And who says you have fight a country to control it. They'll beat us economically.
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 8:42:39 PM EST (GMT-5)
On Saturday 9/11/10 - 8:04:40 PM seta wrote:
the Chinese supported NK during the Korean war
On Saturday 9/11/10 - 8:35:06 PM griffin_wf wrote:
"The 50's are long past and now China is much more capitalist and has a lot more to lose."
On Saturday 9/11/10 - 8:39:52 PM seta wrote:
America is getting poorer and China is getting Richer. And who says you have fight a country to control it. They'll beat us economically.


We're richer than Britain and have been for the past century.

Britain is nowhere near being subjugated to the US
8 yrs ago - Saturday 9/11/10 - 9:02:35 PM EST (GMT-5)
On Saturday 9/11/10 - 8:04:40 PM seta wrote:
the Chinese supported NK during the Korean war
On Saturday 9/11/10 - 8:35:06 PM griffin_wf wrote:
"The 50's are long past and now China is much more capitalist and has a lot more to lose."
On Saturday 9/11/10 - 8:39:52 PM seta wrote:
America is getting poorer and China is getting Richer. And who says you have fight a country to control it. They'll beat us economically.
On Saturday 9/11/10 - 8:42:39 PM griffin_wf wrote:
We're richer than Britain and have been for the past century. Britain is nowhere near being subjugated to the US

Thats because Britan is not a desirable target. China is now the second richest country

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