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AL GOP senate candidate Roy Moore accused of making sexual advances toward underage girls

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13 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 12:02:46 AM EST (GMT-5)
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On Thursday 11/9/17 - 11:56:19 PM Rik_Khaos wrote:
The reason I think dumping him is better politically is this will not be resolved one way or the other before the election. It's going to continue to weigh him down and could cause a split republican electorate. The person they would organize around would be a currently sitting, though appointed, Senator. It's not like they would be starting from scratch. Trump had already endorsed him which helps with the base. Right now keeping him poses greater risk of losing to a Democrat in my opinion.


You might be right.
13 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 12:02:54 AM EST (GMT-5)
Then you aren't qualified to comment on whether or not the allegation is credible. The reporting is extensive and extremely well-sourced.

And quality journalism is worth paying for. Maybe you should pony up a few bucks a month, rather than always using "paywall" as an excuse.
13 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 12:11:24 AM EST (GMT-5)
Ok, i may not be qualified, but a trial by media isn't a proper conviction either- - particularly with all the biased news these days...
13 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 12:17:00 AM EST (GMT-5)
So the position you're taking is unless there's a conviction, you don't believe women. Got it.

I'd just like to reiterate my statement from earlier in the thread: I hope the women in your life know this about you.
12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 1:22:58 AM EST (GMT-5)
Why do you continue to argue with this obvious troll?

It only makes you look stupid for failing to recognise he is talking absolute sh*t.
12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 1:42:13 AM EST (GMT-5)
On Friday 11/10/17 - 1:22:58 AM Boredofu wrote:
Why do you continue to argue with this obvious troll? It only makes you look stupid for failing to recognise he is talking absolute sh*t.


I agree that CD is a troll, but I’ve seen similar comments from other people about sexual harassment, being innocent until proven guilty, etc., and I just have to point out that this rationale for doing nothing about sexual harassment is just really dumb.

I agree with Bird, that it’s relevant in evaluating political candidates. But I hear it most often in response to decisions to fire employees (which was semi-discussed in this thread). If you’re an employer and you hold to that belief, that harassers should only be judged in court, you’re asking for a lawsuit because employers are responsible for protecting their employees from harassment.
12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 1:49:39 AM EST (GMT-5)
That means that if an employer has reason to believe that an employee may be sexually harassing/assaulting other people and you do nothing about it (e.g. no investigation, discussion, training, discipline), you’re putting yourself at risk if an employee/customer later makes a complaint. If you’re interested in protecting yourself, your employees, and your customers, you should really act when you hear anything about sexual harassment/assault. You don’t have to wait for a victim to come to you personally.

*this is more for YTers in the US. It is common for other employees to have employment contracts which might contain certain procedural requirements, and discrimination laws in other countries will, obviously, vary.
12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 5:07:27 AM EST (GMT-5)
#stillfeedingthetroll
12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 5:43:24 AM EST (GMT-5)
That was not for CD. That was for people who’ve said similar things in the past.
12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 5:51:12 AM EST (GMT-5)
Democrats face lowest approval in 22 years.

We are so far into an unwinnable war that sons can fight on the same front that their fathers did.

Republicans face lowest approval in 25 years.

YEAH BUT WHO WON THIS WEEK IN THE DICK MEASURING CONTEST?!
12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 5:53:26 AM EST (GMT-5)
Oh right, old dudes jacking off in the faces of others.

For the purposes of humor, Mariah Carey counts. I admit I do not know which of the 45 other genders she associates with.
12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 6:05:45 AM EST (GMT-5)
On Friday 11/10/17 - 5:43:24 AM Courtbebe wrote:
That was not for CD. That was for people who’ve said similar things in the past.


He won't care he will still feed off it.
12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 7:33:26 AM EST (GMT-5)
On Friday 1:42:13 AM Courtbebe wrote:
I agree that CD is a troll, but I’ve seen similar comments from other people about sexual harassment, being innocent until proven guilty, etc., and I just have to point out that this rationale for doing nothing about sexual harassment is just really dumb.


This is why I brought up the Clinton thing. At the time, people like Bird argued that his sexual activities had nothing to do with his ability to be President, but they now insist that Moore be disqualified over a single alleged incident that took place 40 years before. Sorry, but I feel that politics is a factor here.

I do think that sexual harassment of coworkers is something that should be addressed by employers, but should employers really be firing workers for sexual harassment incidents that happened decades before the guy even became an employee?
12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 7:47:59 AM EST (GMT-5)
nom nom nom nom nom
12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 10:34:27 AM EST (GMT-5)
On Friday 11/10/17 - 7:47:59 AM Boredofu wrote:
nom nom nom nom nom

Yes, you're really contributing to anything at all by doing this. Well done.
12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 10:41:38 AM EST (GMT-5)
And I'm not making any legal argument or saying what's technically possible.
I'm just pointing out that reactions like CowDung's are exactly why women and girls wait 40 years to say anything about stuff like this. Because men DO NOT CARE. They'll still elect the abuser to high office, even if it's true (and you're probably lying anyway, because it's been so many years) (and anyway, you have to meet this impossible standard of proof before I'll agree this should affect the poor man's career) (and I'm totally not arguing from a position of bad faith when I say "if it's true" he should step aside. Nope, definitely not just looking for the tiniest window of plausible deniability to wriggle out of so I don't have to take an actual stand).

It's disgusting. And hurtful to anyone who's ever kept this kind of secret, and reinforces that no, if we'd spoken up at the time, no one would've cared.
12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 10:54:47 AM EST (GMT-5)
It's really not a matter of not caring. It's a matter of judging a guy 40 years afterward for a single alleged incident.

I think there's a difference between an ongoing sex abuser and a one time sex abuser that has not reoffended for decades when it comes to judging whether he's fit to hold a job or not.



12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 11:02:38 AM EST (GMT-5)
When you say "oh well he only did it once" then you are saying you don't care about that woman's (girl's) experience. It isn't enough to matter to you. That is exactly what you are saying, by saying you'd vote for the guy and it shouldn't keep him from holding office.
(And it wasn't once, either. There was at least one other case in the article you still haven't read, where there was CLEARLY grooming behavior on his part *before* the girl turned 16, just not any physical contact before then. That is just as predatory, and you know it.)
12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 11:08:07 AM EST (GMT-5)
I will say again: men like you are the reason women wait decades to talk about these things. That is where you are positioning yourself within the culture, make no mistake about it. As a person who is contributing to keeping victims of sexual abuse, assault, and harassment silent for years. If that is where you want to be, then fine. But I doubt it is. And if it isn't, you need to take a serious look at your values and priorities, engage with women *in good faith* and listen to what they're saying, and find ways to alter your behavior. Because right now, dude, you're being the bad guy.
12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 11:15:57 AM EST (GMT-5)
Fine, I'm the bad guy. Maybe I should join the 'good guys' and insist that people be labeled as permanently unemployable as a result of an alleged indiscretion from 1979.




12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 11:16:04 AM EST (GMT-5)
If it is true I would judge someone for molesting just one child 40 years later. I'd judge him for the rest of my life. I'd judge someone that molested children from the beginning of time until the end of time. Even if he did not reoffend.
12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 11:18:30 AM EST (GMT-5)
On Friday 11/10/17 - 11:16:04 AM petitefleur wrote:
If it is true I would judge someone for molesting just one child 40 years later. I'd judge him for the rest of my life. I'd judge someone that molested children from the beginning of time until the end of time. Even if he did not reoffend.


What is the extent of your judgement? Are in the 'he should never be employed' camp?

12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 11:19:16 AM EST (GMT-5)
He shouldn't be employedin a position where the moral standard is set to a high bar.
12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 11:21:33 AM EST (GMT-5)
On Friday 11/10/17 - 11:15:57 AM CowDung wrote:
Fine, I'm the bad guy.


It's extremely disappointing that you're just OK with this. I thought you were a better human being than that.
12 days ago - Friday 11/10/17 - 11:21:37 AM EST (GMT-5)
I can see limiting employment if he were to be a schoolteacher, but I don't think that an allegation necessarily disqualifies him from being a judge or lawmaker.

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